Retired General Ben Hodges, the former commander of US forces in Europe, says former President Donald Trump’s distaste for NATO is not because some member states are not meeting a voluntary commitment to spend 2% of GDP on defense, reports Business Insider.

“Trump hates alliances. He hates commitments that would force him to do something,” said Hodges, who commanded US forces in Europe from 2014 to 2017, in an interview with The London Times.

“As a thug, he doesn’t want anyone to limit his options in any way. He does not care about moral obligations. He would be ready to throw everything (NATO) in the trash,” he added.

His interview with British media came after Trump sparked concern in Europe during a campaign rally on Saturday when he suggested the US could stop defending NATO countries that do not spend enough on defense.

Numerous high-ranking European officials, as well as the administration of Democrats in the White House, condemned the words of the former Republican president. Jens Stoltenberg, NATO’s secretary general, also spoke out uncharacteristically harshly about Donald Trump’s statements, warning that they undermine the alliance’s “total security” and “put American and European soldiers at increased risk.”

Gen. Ben Hodges says Trump is “absolutely ready” to leave Europe

During a rally in South Carolina, the former American president said that if he returns to the Oval Office, he will not “protect” from Russia countries that do not adhere to the NATO goal of spending 2% of GDP on defense. “I would actually encourage them to do whatever they want,” Trump said of the Russians, questioning NATO’s commitment to collective defense.

His comments were condemned, including by some members of the Republican Party, to which he belongs, while others suggested they should be viewed through the lens of campaign logic as the November presidential election campaign in the United States is in full swing.

But General Hodges told The Times that he believed Trump was “absolutely ready” to leave Europe if he became president again.

“We shouldn’t be naive enough not to take exactly what he’s saying,” the former commander of US forces in Europe warned the former US supreme commander.

“During his last term, there were people around him who were able to hold some things back, at least for a period of time. He won’t make the same mistake again,” a US general warned Donald Trump, as a new Reuters/Ipsos poll released on Tuesday showed him maintaining a 3 percentage point lead over Joe Biden in the voting choices of American voters.

Another retired American general talks about the withdrawal of security from some NATO countries

Also on Tuesday, retired Lt. Gen. Kate Kellogg, Trump’s former National Security Council chief of staff, said in an interview that if a NATO country does not spend at least 2 percent of its gross domestic product on defense, she will support removing protections for that nation.

Kellogg declined to say whether he had discussed his proposal with Trump, though he said the two have often discussed the future of NATO.

Kellogg said that if Trump wins, he will likely propose holding a NATO meeting in June 2025 to discuss the future of the alliance. He said that NATO could eventually become a “multi-tiered alliance” where some members enjoy greater protection based on their adherence to NATO’s founding articles.

Trump’s campaign team did not respond to a request for comment, but previously identified Kellogg as a political adviser who could play a role in his administration.